[lazarus] Asserts and other stuff
Lothian, Nicholas (ETSA)
Lothian.Nicholas at etsa.com.au
Fri Jun 25 00:45:03 EDT 1999
Hi all. I've been lurking for a while, but decided it was time to speak.
Borland are releasing J++ Builder for Linux second quarter of next year,
after a Solaris release late this year or early next. I saw a screen
shot of it running on Linux+GNOME at a recent Borland roadshow here in
Adelaide. They also talked a bit about maybe porting C++ Builder, but
there were no definite plans.
Having said that, I wouldn't count on Java GUI's being fast enough for
usage in most projects for another few years, esp. in large projects.
I've done some work in it, and while Java is great for server side
applets, in most client applications the GUI speed is slower than I
remember Windows 3.1 being on my old 386.
Before GNOME & KDE came out (say back in '95-97), there seemed to be a
general feeling in the Linux community that there was no need to work on
a good GUI, because Java would get there soon. Since then, GNOME and KDE
have both been written from scratch, and either make a better choice for
a desktop environment at the moment that Java (IMHO).
The other thing is (and I may be wrong here) that 'Java in the Kernel'
isn't really happening. What the Kernel allows you to do (and has done
for a while) is allows you to run any binary format you have a
interpreter. You still need your JVM as a separate program. Correct me
if I am wrong about this.
Anyway, I'm looking forward to the day when I can use Lazarus to program
under Linux the just have to recompile them for Win32.
>----------
>From: d0hb0y[SMTP:d0hb0y at lynq.com]
>Sent: Friday, 25 June 1999 13:34
>To: lazarus at miraclec.com
>Subject: Re: [lazarus] Asserts and other stuff
>
>I just wanted to add, I have heard of efforts to bring java development
>environments over to Linux as a separate product .. stuff like Borland's
>J++Builder and stuff like that. I dont recall if Borland was actually
>going to do it, (I think they rumoured it). Anyway, undoubtedly a GUI Java
>Dev environment would be ideal for many people, especially an open source
>one. I agree with Mike on the speed issue -- as far as a tight
>object-pascal compiler, it just seems like un-neccessary overhead.
>
>Unfortunately, due to my job's demands I do not have the time to
>participate in the development process of this project -- however I do like
>to throw in my 2 cents every once in a while :)
>
>== Ron
>
>At 08:45 PM 6/24/99 -0700, you wrote:
>>I believe you're correct, Ron. And that's even beside the point, as far as
>>I'm concerned. I've never liked java because the apps seem sluggish and
>>running the jvm makes my box sluggish. People that know much more than me
>>won't touch java for those and other reasons. I for one would never
>>compile the jvm into my kernal because I don't need the weight.
>>
>>I'm trying to develop a cross platform gui app using fpc/gtk. It would
>>definately be easier to use java but I'm biting the bullet now for a
>>compact, high performance app down the road. Ever since I made the jump
>>from vb to delphi several years ago I've felt this way and I'm not turning
>>back.
>>
>>Cliff: I hope you give this some more thought. Lazarus is a great idea and
>>making some headway, the past month notwithstanding. An open souce
>>Delphi-like tool that will build cross-platform apps is the way of the
>>future, in my opinion. You might also want to test the waters for general
>>opinion of Java - many people aren't fans.
>>
>>Keep up the good work!
>>
>>Mike
>>
>>At 22:57 6/24/99 -0400, you wrote:
>>>I must be missing something. I dont see how a Java Virtual Machine
>>>replaces a Desktop Environment such as KDE or GNOME. Now, I'm no Java
>>>programmer so i'll take your word that Java does all that GUI Interface
>>>stuff coolly.. If I am understanding you correctly, you would want to use
>>>java's already implemented GUI interfaces, which are unto themselves and do
>>>not rely on KDE or GNOME. My question then is, how do you achieve
>>>integration with controls which are configured by KDE, Gnome, or some other
>>>desktop environment -- in other words, shouldn't the controls appear to be
>>>subclassed from the standard controls provided, with the user's color
>>>selection and graphic style?
>>>
>>>Maybe I am missing the point, or my lack of technical understanding behind
>>>desktop environments like KDE and GNOME -- and how they interact with Java.
>>>
>>>== Ron
>>>
>>>At 08:34 PM 6/24/99 -0500, you wrote:
>>>>Hello Everyone...
>>>>
>>>> I have been deeply in some work and besides the weather has been
>>>>absolutely great. (Makes it harder to sit behind a PC)
>>>>
>>>>Myself and Shane live in Wisconsin that means that we only see about three
>>>>months of summer before the weather gets ugly.
>>>>
>>>>I sort of blame myself for the stall of the project currently but I hope
>>>>to
>>>>resume my work in a few weeks.
>>>>
>>>>Personally I wish to keep continuning the effort but in my heart I really
>>>>believe that Linux GNOME and KDE is going to go away in the future. I have
>>>>thought much about this and can see a evolution starting to mount.
>>>>
>>>>I believe that real soon someone is going to figure out that it is not a
>>>>big
>>>>deal to embed a JVM Java Virtual Machine into the linux kernel. Well this
>>>>can already be done with the latest relase but soon we will see someone
>>>>start distributing it. Now that is a really good idea and wish that I had
>>>>the resources and time to do it myself. Think about it no GUI stuff to
>>>>build
>>>>it already is there. Java is so much like the Pascal Languge it is almost
>>>>theft. Not to mention all of the net support that is built into it.
>>>>
>>>>Just sharing a few of my thoughts..
>>>>
>>>>Not gone just taking a little break guys. Myself and Shane worked 24/7 for
>>>>about 4 months on what has already been built. Once things calm down for
>>>>me
>>>>a little I will jump back in.
>>>>
>>>>The newest compiler has been released "Cool"
>>>>
>>>>Cliff
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>>From: Michael A. Hess <mhess at miraclec.com>
>>>>To: lazarus at miraclec.com <lazarus at miraclec.com>
>>>>Date: Thursday, June 24, 1999 3:05 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: [lazarus] Asserts and other stuff
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>John Margaglione wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, is there a list of what components are being wrapped, which
>>>>>> are being worked on by who, etc?
>>>>>> Maybe we could have a project progress page with a list of todo's and
>>>>>> responsible parties.
>>>>>
>>>>>There is only a few of use doing any work on the Lazarus code. I think
>>>>>what has happened is that for a variety of reasons we have all hit a
>>>>>snag due to other work that has kept us from doing much the last several
>>>>>weeks. I myself hope to untangle a little time starting next week to get
>>>>>back into it. More so now that v12 is officially released.
>>>>>
>>>>>As for myself when I get into it I will be working more on the messaging
>>>>>between GTK and FPC. I am trying to separate as much of the FCL from the
>>>>>API that is being used so that it will be easier to use the FCL with say
>>>>>with Gnome, QT, xWindows, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>>I'm all for the list of what to do and who's doing it.
>>>>>
>>>>>So you can be put me down as working on the FCL-GTK interface.
>>>>>
>>>>>--
>>>>>==== Programming my first best destiny! ====
>>>>>
>>>>>Michael A. Hess Miracle Concepts, Inc.
>>>>>mhess at miraclec.com http://www.miraclec.com
>>>>>
>>>>>_________________________________________________________________
>>>>> To unsubscribe: mail lazarus-request at miraclec.com with
>>>>> "unsubscribe" as the Subject
>>>>> archives at http://www.miraclec.com/list_archives/lazarus
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_________________________________________________________________
>>>> To unsubscribe: mail lazarus-request at miraclec.com with
>>>> "unsubscribe" as the Subject
>>>> archives at http://www.miraclec.com/list_archives/lazarus
>>>
>>>_________________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe: mail lazarus-request at miraclec.com with
>>> "unsubscribe" as the Subject
>>> archives at http://www.miraclec.com/list_archives/lazarus
>>>
>>>
>>
>>_________________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe: mail lazarus-request at miraclec.com with
>> "unsubscribe" as the Subject
>> archives at http://www.miraclec.com/list_archives/lazarus
>
>_________________________________________________________________
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> "unsubscribe" as the Subject
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>
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