[Lazarus] Do we really need a PaintSwastika procedure?

[Tony Whyman]

Juha,

Well said. This clearly came from the heart. It is not important as to 
whether or not I agree with what you have said. What is important is 
that you have and have exercised the right of free speech and that is 
what this is all about. Free speech may not include the "right to shout 
fire in a crowded theatre", but it does and should include the right to 
offend.

Totalitarian regimes whether they be Fascist or Communist fear free 
speech more than anything else and it is our strongest weapon against 
them. It should never be compromised.

If anyone has any doubts about whether or not the whole precept of this 
thread is wrong then they need only to take a look at  "The Stoning" 
sketch from Monty Python's Life of Brian. Here we have a man being 
stoned to death for simply saying that "that Halibut was fit for 
Jehovah". The context was irrelevant. The mere fact that he said 
"Jehovah" was enough to condemn him. There then follows sketch of total 
farce whether anyone who makes the mistake of referring to the fact that 
he said "Jehovah" is themselves stoned.

That sketch is almost a modern parable because it is telling us that 
it's not the word or symbol that is important. It is the context in 
which it is used.

If a Hindu uses a PaintSwastika procedure to print out a religious tract 
then what is the problem? On the other hand if some silly kid uses it to 
print out a offensive poster, etc. etc. then they only make themselves 
look stupid and ignorant and, in the worst case, there are laws to 
handle this. Either way, blaming Lazarus for the allowing the second 
case is denying the right of the first to pursue their lawful business 
and is just basically wrong.

And worse: you are on the slippery slope to proposing that English is 
replaced by a language called Newspeak where it is impossible to utter 
or think an heretical thought.

Let's end this double plus ungood quackspeak.

Good day

Tony Whyman

On 07/01/16 19:29, Juha Manninen wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 7, 2016 at 1:41 PM, Terry A. Haimann <terry at haimann.us> wrote:
>> As someone of Jewish heritage I say get rid of it.
> Mattias actually removed the function, obeying like a good German boy
> when somebody with "Jewish heritage" tells him. Uhhh, I can't believe
> he did so!
>
> I planned to write "let's stop this nonsense before this project is
> pulled into politics", but now it is too late.
> Removing an ancient graph which is part of human heritage only for
> political reasons has a strong symbolic meaning.
> This project had no political or religious connections before this
> thread, at least that I knew of.
> The symbols drawn by the lib were not presented in any political
> context. Nobody saw a problem during the years.
> Anthony, I am surprised by your attitude and lack of perspective. Your
> thread practically turned this project into politics. Damn!
>
> Swastika is used in far East in Hinduism, Jainism, Buddism and others.
> It is not only history, it is used currently today.
> Its meanings are prosperity, security, glory, "good luck", "God's energy" etc.
> Anybody from India reading this? This mail thread must appear rather
> weird. Many Indian people don't know what Judaism or Nazism are
> exactly, or at least don't have strong emotions about them.
>
> More perspective: I would welcome a PaintHammerAndSickle procedure to
> the lib from Dmitry, although it carries negative association in my
> country and in other ex-Soviet neighbours, and for a reason.
> Still, it is just a graph. The purpose of this project is not to judge
> any graph symbol. They happen to exist for whatever reason.
>
> Historical fact is that Stalin's governance killed MORE people than
> Hitler's. He was MORE evil by any measurement.
> He just killed a minority after another without any plan by pure evilness.
> If you read what happened in countries occupied by Soviet Union, it
> matches the Holocaust. However those people could not complain to
> anybody, the propaganda made them look guilty instead.
> Why was Stalin not convicted as a war criminal and hung? Well, because
> he happened to win the war!
> The history is always written by winners. I think it was politically
> incorrect to write critically about him now.
> However it is politically correct to criticise Nazis. When somebody
> with "Jewish heritage" tells to remove an ancient symbol only because
> Nazis happened to use it some 75 years ago, everybody must obey and
> nod their heads in acceptance.
> Uhhh, this sucks badly!
>
> What about USA? They have attacked countries around the world during
> decades, sometimes secretly, sometimes openly, killing people only
> because they didn't happen to like the government. That is evil, too.
> Should we ban all symbols associated with USA?
>
> No, censoring graph symbols would be a never-ending swamp. This is an
> international project but the world is unjust.
> Always there is some group who is treated bad by some other group and
> want to ban their symbols.
> This project must be outside of politics! If there is a graph library,
> it must be allowed to draw any important symbol.
> Actually that is the best way to advance world peace. When symbols are
> side by side, it dilutes their associations in people's minds and
> makes them more neutral.
>
> This library is for simple graphs which can be easily drawn
> programmatically which is true for most old well-known symbols.
> The Star of David qualifies for sure, as do most other religious
> symbols. Some people may be offended by Star of David, namely
> Palestinians who are treated very badly by Jewish people.
> BTW, why is that? It looks like Jewish people learned only the
> violence from their WW2 experiences.
> Yes, I feel justified to ask this because you wanted to affect our
> project for political reasons.
>
> Anyway, I have a plan:
> Seppo has made routines to draw many other graphs, including hundreds
> of national flags. They don't belong to LCL but could be added as a
> package with a demo application.
> The procedures from ExtGraphics should be moved there as well. Then
> more old well-known symbols can be added there, too.
> The package will contain swastika, too. If somebody is not happy with
> it, he must find a "politically correct" project then.
>
> This project must not be "politically correct", it must remain
> "politically neutral".
>
> Juha
>
> --
> _______________________________________________
> Lazarus mailing list
> Lazarus at lists.lazarus.freepascal.org
> http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus